Episode 47: Regulating Nitrogen
“The Irrigated Lands Program is the only regulation in the US that sets targets and limits for nitrogen discharges. It is a pretty long time scale until we get to the low numbers, the idea is to bring the nitrogen discharges from irrigated agriculture into balance.”
A conversation with Claire Bjork (Central Coast Regional Water Board) about groundwater nitrogen policy, water quality compliance, and the Irrigated Lands Regulatory Program. Released April 7, 2023
guests on the show
Claire Bjork
Claire Bjork studied Environmental Policy Analysis and Planning at UC Davis and was an Undergraduate Podcast Producer for Water Talk during its second season. Upon graduating in 2021, Claire took a position with the University of California Cooperative Extension office in Modoc County, where she spent a year working on projects related to SGMA implementation and rangeland management. During this time, Claire developed a practical understanding of intersectionality in water decision-making across varying geographic and temporal scales.
Originally from Santa Barbara, Claire moved to San Luis Obispo in 2022 and now works as an Environmental Scientist with the Regional Water Board’s Irrigated Lands Program. In her current position, she enjoys collaborating with growers and other community members to protect water quality.
Learn more about the Central Coast Regional Water Board's Irrigated Lands Program here and connect with Claire Bjork here.
TRANSCRIPT
Mallika Nocco 00:00
Welcome to Water Talk. In today's episode we are talking about groundwater, nitrogen, irrigated agriculture, and water quality in general and our guest is Claire Bjork, a staff environmental scientist with the Central Coast Regional Water Quality Board, which is an organization that makes critical water quality decisions for its region to protect and restore water quality in a 300-mile-long coastal region. And we are super excited because before Claire Bjork was a staff environmental scientist, she was a Water Talk production intern.
So, Claire has moved on from working with us on this podcast to do some really wonderful and fantastic things around the state. She was up in Modoc County working with UCANR. And she actually helped provide support and education around the groundwater sustainability planning process in that area. And then now she's moved on to this position with the Central Coast Water Quality Board. So, we feel really, really proud of Claire, and are super excited to have her back on and catch up with her and see what she's been up to. Sam, Faith. How are you feeling about seeing Claire again?
Faith Kearns
I mean, I'm always happy to talk with Claire, you know, we first met her as an undergraduate at Davis when she was working with us in the very, very early iteration of our podcast when we were still doing it as a webinar, you know, was so enthusiastic about all of the topics that we worked on, and just always really a joy to work with. And it was awesome to see her go on and actually work with another Water Talk guest of ours, Laura Snell, who's up in Modoc County. And I'm really excited to hear more about her latest adventures and probably learn a lot more from her about some of the things that I've worked on in the past, but haven't been keeping up with. So, yeah, really looking forward to talking with Claire.
Sam Sandoval
Yes, it's good to talk again, with Claire. I was remembering she took one of my classes, so she was part of the students that I had, and then went into the podcast. Something that I am also looking forward to, besides catching up with her, is the conversation to get today about the Irrigated Lands Regulatory Program. And I wonder if she can provide the perspective of how the coalitions are seen between the regulatory agency and the water users-agriculture.
Because that is an interesting kind of middleman, they are perceived as the regulatory hand, the regulatory arm, from the water users. And at the same time, the regulators, the water boards, perceive them as part of the users. So, they are in this kind of duel when they receive sometimes some criticism from both ends. So anyway, I look forward to having those kinds of discussions. And of course, to talk again, with Claire.
Mallika Nocco
When I was looking up and doing a little bit of research on this particular Water Quality Control Board and the Water Quality Control Boards in general. And it's interesting because the water quality control boards are all a little different. They're these kind of semi-autonomous boards that function, but they all have terms like monitoring and compliance associated with them. And whenever you think about monitoring and compliance oftentimes that means you can be put in a tricky position. Water quality, especially when we talk about nitrogen and agriculture, can get pretty contentious. And just to share a little bit of just the basic science background, I think that we can all share some information just thinking about some of the work that we do.
So, I work in irrigation. My lab is called the Conservation Irrigation Lab, and there is this fundamental relationship between water that we use for agriculture and fertilizer that we use for agriculture, especially when we're talking about nitrogen fertilizer. And you know that the timing of when nitrogen is applied, the amount of nitrogen that's applied for plants, in concert with the amount of water that's applied, if the amount of water that is applied exceeds the need of plants, then that water can exit the root zone and if there is excess nitrogen in the root zone, then that water will carry that nitrogen with it, most frequently as nitrate, through the root zone and through the soil and through the vadose zone and eventually to the groundwater. And this is not a problem that's unique to California, this is a problem that happens in many, many places. And you see it a lot in areas where there's sandy soils. So, the sandier your soil is, the more you can see this type of drainage and excess nitrate in groundwater.
The region that I actually was working in, before I moved to California, we had very similar issues with nitrate and groundwater. But there's an issue with nitrate and groundwater in that it can be very damaging to human health, especially infants. Because infants have a special type of hemoglobin, and nitrate, when there's excess nitrate in drinking water, it can actually bind to that hemoglobin that infants have. And when it binds with the nitrate in blood, if there's enough nitrate that's flowing through the water, if the concentration is high enough, oxygen can actually be blocked from binding to the hemoglobin. And that's when you see these infant adverse health effects. And people actually, it's a sad term, but they call it Blue Baby Syndrome.
So, this reason, this issue of having Blue Baby Syndrome in infants, and this concern for human health is why the EPA, the US EPA, and the California EPA have established this limit, or maximum contaminant load of 10 parts per million of nitrate in the groundwater. And there are many areas in California, especially agricultural regions, where the nitrate concentration in the groundwater regularly exceeds this limit. And what I think is forward looking about California that's different from a lot of other places is that there is this Irrigated Lands Regulatory Program in place that we're going to talk about today to try to wrangle these nitrate concentrations that are in the groundwater,
Sam Sandoval
Yes, and also, to have this as a perspective, Salinas Valley, all that area is one of the main regions that produces vegetables. And vegetables, they require an important amount of fertilizer nitrogen. So that's why we have some of those problems there. Specifically in this region for instance, in Salinas, water that comes out of the wells already has nitrogen in it. So the fertilizer, the nitrogen, has already reached that part, that they have to be now also worried that there is already fertilizer coming out of the well.
And the important part also in there is who is being affected. And these are a several disadvantaged communities, communities of color, people that work in agriculture, that are trying to do a good job of producing the food that we eat. Whenever you're getting yourself, you're gonna see that that's what we're talking about: the people that are producing and how they are at risk.
Mallika Nocco
Exactly. So, this program is all about accounting for the nitrogen that's already in the groundwater. And another way to think about this is if you're using groundwater for irrigation, you're also inadvertently, or hopefully more and more intentionally, fertilizing. And what we would like folks to do is just do some math and accounting to budget out that nitrogen that's already present in groundwater, just so you don't apply an excess of it.
And so, it's not really asking even people to cut back from what is needed to grow a healthy crop. It's just saying, let's take into account what's already going to be in your groundwater. And what's wild to me is that it seems like a very reasonable policy. But I know that in other states, we've had challenges trying to make this accounting happen.
We're so excited to have Claire back on the show. Claire, welcome to Water Talk again.
Claire Bjork
Thank you so much. It's really great to be here. And I'm just really excited to see you all and to have a little bit of experience in the water field under my belt.
Mallika Nocco
Yeah, so let's talk about that. So, we're so proud of everything you've been up to since working with us in your undergrad days back in 2020 and 2021. Can you tell us a little bit about your adventures across California after you left Davis?
Claire Bjork
Yeah, definitely. So, kind of a fun story. I, after working on one of the episodes, connected with Laura Snell, who does some work up in Modoc County out of Alturas. She really does a lot of different things, but I really resonated with the wild horse research that she talked about when she was on the podcast. And so, I ended up going and working with her for a year. And while there, I ended up doing a lot of groundwater work, actually, which I think it's so funny: water is just that nexus that connects everything–water, horses, groundwater, ag everything.
I worked a lot with the groundwater sustainability agency for a really small groundwater basin called Big Valley. And while doing that, I learned how to do some groundwater contours and do well sampling and some of the on the ground research that goes into gathering all the data that you need to support your groundwater sustainability plan. But then I also did some other things like rangeland monitoring, and notably, built some Beaver Dam analogues with a group of really cool folks out of Sonoma County. It was a lot of fun. And also went duck catching at one point.
Mallika Nocco
Wow, that's amazing. So can you tell us like how, how did you end up in the Central Coast?
Claire Bjork
I grew up in Santa Barbara. And so, this area really has felt the most like home to me. And so, for a while I was gravitating towards coming back here. And it ended up aligning really well. I spoke with some folks who worked at the Water Board down in the Central Coast region and kind of came up to speed on some of the issues that are unique to this area, because Modoc county is way up in northeastern California. And I think if we're going to speak about Water Boards on different regional levels, there's nine of them, right, there's the Central Valley region, which is huge, and covers where I was at, and Modoc County all the way down through Davis and the Central Valley. So, as you can imagine, just huge diversity in, not just geography, but also people. And so that's kind of a fascinating lens to look at water management.
But the Central Coast, you know, it's probably the most groundwater dependent region and groundwater is something that I'm really interested in. I think long term, that's really where my heart is, even though, you know, undeniably, there's that connection between groundwater and surface water and everything's connected. But I ended up coming back down here after I got a job with the Central Coast Regional Water Quality Control Board. And now I work in the Irrigated Lands Program, which is a pretty big program. There's, I believe, about 4000 farms or ranches enrolled. So, it's huge. And we cover, as you said, at the beginning of the podcast, you know, down towards Carpenteria, all the way up to Santa Cruz County.
Sam Sandoval
Yeah, definitely. It's a very large area. So, I'm seeing the map. Yeah, it is those nine regions. And definitely the Irrigated Lands Regulatory Program is the overlap between groundwater, water quality, and all the interest that you have. So could you tell us about the program, the Irrigated Lands Regulatory Program and the work that you do related with that?
Claire Bjork
Yes, absolutely. And you know, before I really dive in, I want to make it clear, I'm not really speaking on behalf of the Water Board, but just my experiences as a staff person. But with the Irrigated Lands Regulatory Program in the Central Coast region, I think it's really exciting to be an early career professional in this field, because it's, to my knowledge, the only regulation in I think the United States that sets targets and limits for nitrogen discharges. And so, it's a pretty long timescale until we get to some of the really small numbers. But the idea is to bring the nitrogen discharges from irrigated agriculture into balance.
Because, a little bit of a back story on that, I think I got ahead of myself. It's kind of overwhelmingly apparent that with synthetic fertilizers, and since the Industrial Revolution, really high levels of nitrogen and other fertilizers, but especially nitrogen, has been applied for a long time. And so we've been seeing, especially in some areas where there is pretty intensive agriculture, really high levels of nitrogen as nitrate in groundwater, which presents some pretty significant health risks for the people who are drinking that water or using it for their personal use.
And so it's definitely something that we have reason to be concerned about. And for me, that's something coming out of Davis, I think a lot of my work has been centered around nitrogen, even going as far back as my first soil science class. A lot of my professors helped write the California Nitrogen Assessment. And so that's always felt very central to who I am in terms of water quality, or my water quality interests.
Mallika Nocco
I think that you brought up so many critical ideas there, just thinking that there's this legacy of nitrogen that's being applied. And then there's this legacy of nitrogen and soils that we think about, and especially right now, with all the rains that are coming through. When there is just nitrogen that's been stored in the soil, sometimes it can be mobilized right as nitrate, and just move into the groundwater. And I appreciate too, I didn't realize it was the only program in the US that has these limits on? What was it exactly?
Claire Bjork
So eventually, as growers work to come into compliance with these different limits and targets, basically, the idea is to restrict the amount of nitrogen that is being applied to slow down the momentum, so to speak, or the movement of the nitrate through the soil profile into groundwater, and that's the long-term goal. And then short term, you know, there's some other programs like the State Water Board created an aquifer risk map, which identifies areas where there's different levels of risk, and then they allocate funding based on that.
And so really short term, that's a great resource to use to address some of the shorter-term effects like providing drinking water systems that filter out nitrate or other contaminants. And of course, that's not the only thing that that map considers, there's a bunch of other potential contaminants, like 123 TCP, which is also something that we monitor for, or have growers sample their wells for.
Mallika Nocco
So, Claire, what are your roles and responsibilities with the Irrigated Lands Regulatory Program?
Claire Bjork
It's a great question, thank you. Mostly, on my day to day I provide a lot of one-on-one support to growers who call into our office. And then I also, honestly, that's part of like one of my favorite things about my job, I really like learning about agriculture, I started out at Davis, as a sustainable ag major, and then shifted my focus to environmental policy. Yeah, that's my favorite thing.
And it also helps contextualize a lot of the data that we get, because that's the other part of my job is receiving data and thinking about ways to look at that so that we're creating a picture of what's really going on in the Central Coast region. And right now, from some of our preliminary data, I think it's apparent where we're starting to see nitrate exceedances, in areas that have, and when I say exceedances, I mean, levels that are higher than the MCL, maximum contaminant level.
Mallika Nocco
I was wondering when these growers are calling, what kind of questions do they ask you?
Claire Bjork
A lot of the questions are generally prompted by some sort of letter that they've received from us saying, "Oh, hey, look, we've noticed that you haven't, you know, updated your electronic Notice of Intent", or I just say, "Oh, you know, you've notified the people who are using your domestic well, that they have a level of some contaminant like nitrate or 1,2,3 TCP that's exceeding the limit", or maybe not. And so, a lot of it is just how do I log into the geo tracker and update my records, but then also just general questions.
I'd say my favorite questions are when growers reach out and they want to know, like, preemptively, hey, how should I be thinking about this now? I enjoy thinking through those kinds of complex problems, because it really is like a case by case. I guess you could say like one size doesn't fit all. I hear that a lot in the policy world, and really figuring out how to help on the specific levels, how growers should be keeping records of the nitrogen that they're applying as fertilizer so that they can then later report it to us in a way that's accurate and also helpful for them.
Mallika Nocco
Yeah, so the growers are supposed to do this accounting, right. So, they're supposed to have a nitrogen management plan. A certified crop advisor is responsible for reviewing this plan and signing off on the plan. And I know this just because myself and Faith and Sam, we've all been involved in training those certified crop advisors to review the Nitrogen Management Plan. So once that review is completed, then they've kind of got to execute this plan. So, what kinds of monitoring and compliance tools are used to make sure that folks are standing by these plans and like what happens when people aren't in compliance?
Claire Bjork
Yes, absolutely. And, you know, thank you for all your work, also training up folks to be able to review these plans. And please feel free anytime to reach out for clarification on some of the requirements, because I think you're doing such relevant work, and it's so interesting to follow, especially from irrigation efficiency. And it's so important.
Mallika Nocco
I think you're doing important work, because you're doing extension in a lot of ways, like what you described that's so important. And also, I giggled when you said reach out for clarification?
Claire Bjork
That one always gets to me too. But let me circle back to your question, I got a little off topic. We created some YouTube tutorials for record keeping, as that's a new requirement for a lot of folks coming up down the line. And then recently, we came out with a new requirements checklist, which I think if I can send you a link to that, I think that would be the number one place to go for anybody who has questions about what they specifically need to do.
Because we have different groundwater and surface water phasers, right now we're primarily basing the requirement to submit a total nitrogen applied report and then later an irrigation and nutrient management summary report based on groundwater phase area. And so that's a great tool to figure out when you need to submit that basically, for anyone who's maybe listening and thinking about that. Because especially the irrigation and nutrient management summary report, that is a requirement that's coming up for the first time in the next year. And so that's something to be on top of for record keeping for sure.
Mallika Nocco
But for the first time ever, wow.
Claire Bjork
In our region, yeah.
Sam Sandoval
And also, Claire, I think, related to monitoring, it's really important to do monitoring of a nitrogen because the region that you're talking about, because of the type of crops that are there, there is a lot of a nitrogen already applied, or a legacy of nitrogen applied, and that has already reached groundwater. And many, many times there is groundwater with a fertilizer already coming out of the wells.
Claire Bjork
Yeah, that's a great point, Sam. And that kind of harkens back to when I was working in Modoc County. The growing season there is really short. And so, the kind of agriculture that I was really accustomed to working with was irrigated pasture. And so, a lot of opportunities up there for like flood-MAR or other things that we've talked about on this podcast. And down here, the growing season is all year. So, we see some really intensive crops. And oftentimes, there's a lot of moving parts, too, we see a lot of rotational ranches.
So are farms where it's a shorter growing period for one specific crop, but then you do maybe two or three repetitions of that crop on the same land. And so that's a really great point, because that does definitely factor into the nitrogen that is being applied. And that historically has been applied to. And of course all that ended up down in groundwater. And the nitrogen in irrigation water is something that is factored into the A minus R, or the applied minus removed equation, which is how we calculate nitrogen discharge. And that is a piece of that puzzle, too. So, it's a lot, a lot of moving parts.
Sam Sandoval
Yeah, thank you.
Faith Kearns
So, Claire, Malika had already mentioned a little bit about the training and outreach that has gone on related to water quality, and particularly nitrogen. So how are you currently sort of helping growers and maybe certified crop advisors monitor nitrogen use and leaching from the landscape?
Claire Bjork
That's a great question. It definitely goes back to the resources that we've created because we can't really specifically recommend that any grower use a particular method to calculate nitrogen. And so that's really where crop advisors come in and I'm tremendously grateful for all of the help that our technical assistance providers provide, especially, we’ve got a couple of folks in Monterey County, Dr. Richard Smith and Dr. Eric Brennan, who are associated with UCCE, UC Cooperative Extension, and then USDA ARS, respectively.
And they've created some real user-friendly crop specific tools that growers can use. And that's kind of, you know, that's them taking what we've kind of clarified through our videos and running with that, or through our direct communications to help growers more directly. Because that's not really something that we can fulfill. But we do try to provide that clarification and help growers understand exactly what it is that they need to be reporting, so they can figure out how to report that to us. And it's difficult.
Sam Sandoval
Claire one of the things that have been related with growers, it is also related with the farm workers, because they are the ones that at the end, they are doing a lot of these management, but also the ones that are impacted. So, could you help our audience? Make sure I mean, at the end, when we're trying to protect groundwater for who and why?
Claire Bjork
Yeah, absolutely. I think in a lot of cases, one of the benefits of our program requiring that all of our enrollees test their domestic wells, is that sometimes, I can't speak generally, but in some instances you might have a grower who has tenant farmers or somebody who are not specifically involved in the management or the day-to-day operations. So that ranch, so they're not the ones who are using the water, that maybe is provided as drinking water from the wells that are also located on agricultural lands that are impacted by nitrate, or other contaminants.
And so we require that they test those wells and then provide the wells sampling results to anybody who lives on that parcel, or uses the water from that well, whether it be for drinking or for showering, or other uses, because not so much with nitrate, but with 123 TCP, which is the other contaminate we monitor for. And so that's an issue too, and that's more of like a trace. I do know that it's has a really small MCL. It's like five parts per billion, but it's pretty serious. So yeah, one to keep an eye out for.
Mallika Nocco
What is it? Can you say it again?
Claire Bjork
TCP or 1,2,3 trichloropropane.
Mallika Nocco
What is it? So, it has a really small MCL what is it? Why is it in the water? How does it get there?
Sam Sandoval
It is a pesticide. So, it is a solvent that is associated with pesticide products and has been proven to be a carcinogen. So, the main issue is that it is a precursor for cancer, a carcinogen, and also for the audience to relate. So, everytime that we go and buy our favorite, either herbicide or insecticide, and not sure how many actually read the label, because it is very important. So, the label is the law. That's super clear in the pesticide world. And, as we're kind of going and trying to kill some of the weeds, we need to wear long sleeves, we need to wear gloves, we need to wear shoes that are protective, don't do it on sandals. Because at the end, it is venom, it is a poison. That's why it has the -cide on it, it's an insecticide. It is killing stuff. And if we do not apply it adequately, it may be detrimental for, in this case when it runs off into the stormwater system, into the plants, or into the things that live in the recipient body– rivers, lakes and so on.
The same with fertilizer. I'm thinking of also our listeners applying fertilizer for their grass or for their trees. How many times did we actually think critically like am I applying too much or too few? Because in the end, that's what we're applying, it's going into the ground into the wells and back towards into the tap. And I think it's important to be aware that that's what we're talking about at an agricultural scale, while synthetic fertilizer is applied, but there are alternatives, and pesticides should be the last resort. It's been applied and we have a legacy. And that's why when you are kind of, you're making sure that from now on. We're moving from there.
Mallika Nocco
Thank you, Sam. That was neat for me. I was not familiar with 1,2,3 TCP, so I needed an explanatory comma for that. So, can you tell us then a little bit more back to what you were saying about the wells and testing for the 1,2,3 TCP?
Claire Bjork
Yeah, definitely. In this particular scenario, a lot of small water systems or municipalities will require water testing. But for a lot of domestic wells, if it's not required by something like the agricultural order that my program is managing, those wells might not get tested. And so that's a good way to get information out to people about what they're drinking that they might not otherwise get.
Sam Sandoval
So, Claire, in switching gears here a little bit. But yet related, we are in 2023 March. And as we are in this period of heavy rain, how have these recent atmospheric rivers impacted the Central Coast. And what are the things that you have done to respond to these extreme events?
Claire Bjork
Yeah, definitely. It's pretty heavy. I mean, there's no shortage of news about all the flooding, and especially right now up in Salinas, Monterey, Pajaro, which that's my case management area. And so, I'm a contact point for growers up there. It's been really hard to see that news coming out, because I think it's upwards of hundreds of millions of dollars in crop damage already. And I don't think that the full extent of the damage is really known, but also down in some of the other areas like Santa Maria, Santa Barbara- we've been seeing some pretty excessive coastal flooding.
And so, one of the things our program has done is grant a little bit of an extension on our groundwater wells sampling, or our wells sampling window for growers. Because, you know, a lot of them probably can't even really get out to their fields right now. And we're also aware of some issues in terms of sediment lake discharges, and that kind of thing. And, you know, been working with folks to get that sorted out. And at a certain point, with such widespread flooding, too, you know, it's going to take probably some level of watershed approaches and coordination between folks that maybe even exceeds our own scope, but it's a lot.
Faith Kearns
Hey, Claire, Sam mentioned weather whiplash a little bit. And I'm wondering how you're thinking about climate change, and its impacts to water quality and water resources in the region that you're working right now?
Claire Bjork
Absolutely. I mean, climate change is undeniably a factor that influences so much of water availability. And also because these atmospheric rivers really just as folks are saying, kind of quenched the drought that we've been in, which I don't know if that's quite the language that I would use to describe it. And so, but it's definitely these, I guess whether whiplash is a word that I've seen used.
I think climate change is on everyone's minds. I think it's hard to say exactly how, at this point that's factored into our long-term planning with this particular program. Even months ago, I was talking to growers who had a well that was inoperable because a wildfire had come through. And so, it's all of these different, I guess you could say that climate change is increasing uncertainty. Even if we're not really speaking about it, directly, which we do have conversations about that, I think it's just hard to say exactly how it will in any given year, because I think it really comes down to timescales too, in terms of if we're looking at a growing season of a year, and then our long term like 50 years out from now, where we intend to be with nitrogen levels.
And along those lines, how climate change as an extraneous factor kind of links into all of the other into the data or the other dynamics at play, it really creates that level of uncertainty that we have to be ready to adapt to and, I think probably harbor or have some conversations about how we can be a little more resilient in terms of our adaptation strategies. And I'm definitely interested in how my program, long term, will unfold.
Sam Sandoval
So, Claire, I would like to also share with our audience, a different worldview or different perspective. That people regularly think of regulators or people working for a regulatory agency, that they are separated or distant from the people that they are regulating, but what you're telling us is that you like going to the farmers, you like visiting their farms, get to know about their operations. So can you share with us why it is so important and why someone that is listening here should change the mindset that regulators are distant when, what you're telling me the importance of talking to farmers, visiting them, how that has changed your perspective on the work that you do?
Claire Bjork
Thank you for asking that. It's honestly my favorite question to ask others as well. But I think you know, inviting, I'd like to invite anybody listening in, you as well, to definitely reach out anytime you have questions. Personally, maybe selfishly, I love learning about what other folks are working on. Because I think that's the best way to understand what's really going on in our world. And especially if there's ever anybody who'd like to invite me out to walk around a farm and kind of see what's going on, I think that would be really helpful to me specifically. And also, I just think fostering relationships, and you do such a great job of that on this podcast, too. And having these conversations with such a wide breadth of experts, I think that's a really great way forward.
Sam Sandoval
And also, for our audience, and everyone that gets closer to the people that you think is your regulator, or that you're submitting paperwork, because of what you're saying: behind the desk, there is a person that can learn the nuances, that understand the nuances behind it. I also think that sometimes we get narrow minded in terms of, why people are not seeing this? But rather than just saying, why people are not seeing it, they share it with the person that may help you out on the or that can provide you some good feedback on the regulatory side, or on the scientific side, to actually help you out.
Claire Bjork
Yeah, and I think it is so important to break down some of those walls. I totally get it. I think, in terms of the regulatory side of my job, I am a staff environmental scientist, so I really am one of the folks from the Water Board who works directly with others providing that technical assistance.
I like to see what's going on so I can better understand the issues and how they are unfolding in specific cases. Because, again, it's not one size fits all, there's a lot at play. And I think, in a lot of cases, you know, when we're managing such a big region, one thing that works in one area is probably not going to work in another. And so being able to understand that and figure out how to compensate for that in our data analysis is really important.